Overcoming Adversity on the World Stage: Dan Dearing & Sam Schachter | Ep.115 - Gent's Talk

[00:00:00] You're on the World Stage, the biggest tournament in the world.

[00:00:02] I was like, this can't be happening.

[00:00:04] There's no way.

[00:00:05] Professional Beach volleyball athletes Sam Schachter and Dan Dearing

[00:00:08] are multiple-time Canadian national champions

[00:00:11] and recently competed for Team Canada at the Paris 2024 Summer Games.

[00:00:16] You guys qualified for Paris on the very last day.

[00:00:21] What happened there?

[00:00:23] My low back just decides to say, hey, I'm done with you.

[00:00:27] I see how much pain he's in.

[00:00:28] I see how hard we're trying to make it so we can compete.

[00:00:32] How did you feel in that moment?

[00:00:34] The pain I was in...

[00:00:38] It's so sad that it happened at the Olympics.

[00:00:42] How do you balance the feeling grateful for the opportunity

[00:00:44] but also the negative emotions that naturally arise

[00:00:48] from not achieving the ultimate goal that you went for?

[00:00:51] It's sad. It's deeply sad.

[00:00:52] There's a lot of healing that I think everyone's going to have to do.

[00:00:56] It's not the way we want it to end.

[00:00:59] Can we cut that part out?

[00:01:23] Sure. No problem.

[00:01:24] Dan Dearing is a piece of shit.

[00:01:27] I hope we're recording for that.

[00:01:30] I hope we're recording that part because that part I want to keep it in.

[00:01:34] It's going to be like the trailer of the podcast.

[00:01:38] Gentlemen, welcome to Gents Talk.

[00:01:41] I'm so happy to have this conversation with you guys.

[00:01:43] You're fresh.

[00:01:43] You smell from Paris.

[00:01:45] You smell like you just came from Paris

[00:01:47] unless you were swimming in the river

[00:01:48] then you probably wouldn't smell very good.

[00:01:51] But I'm really excited to have this conversation.

[00:01:53] Dan, you and I have known each other a long time, Sam.

[00:01:56] This is the first time you and I meet

[00:01:58] but I've kind of watched you at a distance

[00:02:01] and heard about you and learned about you through Dan

[00:02:04] who has nothing but bad things to say about you all the time.

[00:02:10] But you were just in Paris competing for Team Canada.

[00:02:12] Congratulations on that.

[00:02:14] That's an incredible feat.

[00:02:16] Your first time, which is a lifelong journey to get there,

[00:02:19] your second time, which is incredible to do a repeat.

[00:02:22] How are you feeling now that it's in the rear view?

[00:02:27] Let's start there.

[00:02:31] Well, looking at that screen, seeing that photo

[00:02:34] really brought again a fluctuation of so many emotions

[00:02:40] coming back from Paris and digesting everything that happened.

[00:02:45] I felt everything from the highest of joys and gratitude

[00:02:49] to the lowest of pain and

[00:02:53] and just the deepest of feelings

[00:02:56] when it comes to the choices that had to be made there.

[00:02:58] So yeah, that's and we're going to talk all about that.

[00:03:03] Oh, yeah, absolutely.

[00:03:05] What about you, Sam?

[00:03:06] Yeah, I mean, same like all of the stuff, all of the emotions.

[00:03:11] It's been a couple of weeks.

[00:03:12] So we've had some time to reflect and sort of look back on the journey

[00:03:17] and do a little bit of gratefulness practice and then also, you know,

[00:03:22] reflect on what we could have done better.

[00:03:24] And I think that brings up a lot for me.

[00:03:28] Things that we would have like to change,

[00:03:29] but also just appreciating having gotten there.

[00:03:32] So obviously those are two very strongly opposing feelings.

[00:03:36] And it was yeah, I mean, obviously excruciating,

[00:03:41] but also incredible that we got to get there in the first place.

[00:03:44] So yeah, I don't know.

[00:03:46] Life happens in the contradiction.

[00:03:49] So having those kinds of mixed emotions, how do you?

[00:03:53] How do you balance those?

[00:03:54] How do you balance the feeling grateful for the opportunity

[00:03:56] but also the negative emotions that naturally arise

[00:04:00] from not achieving the ultimate goal that you went for?

[00:04:05] Yeah, I mean, I think you just experienced that.

[00:04:09] And I think everyone deals with and manages that in their own way.

[00:04:14] My inclination is to look at what I should change.

[00:04:17] And I think I have been that way my entire career.

[00:04:20] I think it's helped me in incredible ways

[00:04:22] and it's also harmed me in, you know,

[00:04:27] ways that I won't be able to ever heal from it.

[00:04:29] And it's like a scar, right?

[00:04:32] So yeah, I mean, can you give me an example?

[00:04:37] Things that you would you look back on decisions

[00:04:40] that you should have made, whether, you know,

[00:04:42] that be continuing a partnership or whether that be

[00:04:48] how you acted, how you performed your preparation

[00:04:52] up to incredible details like, you know,

[00:04:55] why didn't I eat enough food before this match?

[00:04:58] Or why didn't I train hard enough during the off season

[00:05:00] and do my conditioning all the way to bigger choices

[00:05:04] like deciding on which coach to hire

[00:05:06] or which partner to have to play with,

[00:05:08] whether you want to attend a tournament or not.

[00:05:11] So there's a lot of things, a lot of decisions

[00:05:13] that go into every single cycle, like Olympic cycle

[00:05:20] or just journey like career.

[00:05:22] So it's a lot of decisions that you have to look back

[00:05:25] on every little fork in the road.

[00:05:27] And those are incredibly helpful

[00:05:30] in dictating how you potentially act in the future

[00:05:33] and sort of impact your future decisions

[00:05:35] and whether I act in a different way that helps me

[00:05:42] in my next partnership or repeating mistakes

[00:05:45] and being hard on yourself about that.

[00:05:49] So there's a lot of things that go into each cycle,

[00:05:54] each partnership, each journey

[00:05:55] and so easy to look at those things

[00:05:59] that you would change versus so positives.

[00:06:02] Let's start sort of at the beginning here.

[00:06:04] You were in the 2016 Olympics, correct?

[00:06:10] You weren't with Dan at the time.

[00:06:14] So what triggered the change in the partnership?

[00:06:17] When did this even start?

[00:06:19] What was that process like?

[00:06:21] Based on just what I had heard from Dan,

[00:06:23] this was a pandemic baby essentially.

[00:06:26] So maybe walk me through how this partnership

[00:06:29] even began and how it's evolved.

[00:06:35] Okay, each other like who's gonna take?

[00:06:38] Well, after 2016, when I qualified for Rio,

[00:06:42] I played with another guy, Sam Petlow,

[00:06:44] and he was one of the other top blockers.

[00:06:47] He went with us to the Continental Cup in 2016

[00:06:50] where we qualified.

[00:06:52] And that's the guy who I basically earned the qualification

[00:06:55] for the Olympics against.

[00:06:57] You know, we had been talking

[00:06:58] after Josh retired from that.

[00:07:01] My partner for 2016 was Josh Binstock.

[00:07:03] He retired and then I paired up with Sam Petlow

[00:07:05] and then I played that next cycle

[00:07:07] trying to qualify for 2020 in Tokyo with Petlow.

[00:07:11] And then in about 2019, he was indicating

[00:07:15] that he had plans to retire after the Olympics as well.

[00:07:19] So I started looking around.

[00:07:22] And that's when Dan was actually not even playing

[00:07:25] at the time, which was the bizarre part of it.

[00:07:27] And we had played together and against each other

[00:07:31] our entire lives from youth all the way up into

[00:07:36] where we started touring and playing as professionals.

[00:07:39] So he was always on the radar, but for whatever reason

[00:07:43] he had decided to stop playing due to injury

[00:07:45] and maybe other factors as well.

[00:07:49] He can expand on that.

[00:07:50] But I was just through him a question.

[00:07:54] Would you be interested in coming back?

[00:07:56] I know how good we, I believe that we could be

[00:07:59] and thinking that this could be the person

[00:08:01] that I could go on this journey with

[00:08:02] and qualify for Paris with.

[00:08:05] And our rest is history as they say.

[00:08:08] Dan from your perspective, what was happening?

[00:08:12] You were inactive at the time.

[00:08:14] Like you weren't playing professionally.

[00:08:16] You get this phone call from Sam going,

[00:08:19] hey, you interested.

[00:08:21] Well firstly, what was happening with you

[00:08:23] at the point where that resulted in you not playing?

[00:08:27] It all started in January of 2016.

[00:08:33] I came down from a block, really messed up my back

[00:08:37] and from that point on the doctor said take a year off.

[00:08:40] And then after that year off I decided,

[00:08:42] okay, this is behind me.

[00:08:45] I'm gonna focus on full-time work,

[00:08:47] start working as a full-time coach.

[00:08:49] I started opportunities in the nightlife industry,

[00:08:52] working as managers and hosts

[00:08:53] for different clubs throughout Toronto.

[00:08:56] And even then, even though I'm done playing professionally,

[00:09:00] I'm not doing conditioning, I'm not lifting,

[00:09:02] I'm not practicing every day,

[00:09:04] but I still love the sport so I played for joy.

[00:09:07] And I got to play with his old partner Josh Binstock

[00:09:10] who retired from international play

[00:09:12] but he still loved the game

[00:09:13] and him and I just paired up

[00:09:14] and started winning everything in Canada.

[00:09:16] So that was fun.

[00:09:19] And then when I got that phone call

[00:09:22] and I'm like to say a question, the question,

[00:09:25] always in the back of my head I said,

[00:09:26] I could probably give it another go when I'm healthy

[00:09:30] if only one person gave me that call

[00:09:32] and it had to be the best player in the country.

[00:09:34] I was in a relationship at the time,

[00:09:37] thinking long-term goals,

[00:09:38] locked into a condo for rent,

[00:09:40] locked into jobs, thinking of future goals

[00:09:43] and where I wanna take my whole life

[00:09:44] and I had to really stop and consider

[00:09:48] all the sacrifices and choices I would have to make

[00:09:51] in order to do this properly

[00:09:53] and make sure that I was strong in order to do that.

[00:09:59] And then COVID hit, which gave an opportunity

[00:10:02] for kind of life to change on its own

[00:10:05] without me having to make those choices,

[00:10:07] which I think was a blessing.

[00:10:10] And then transitioning to show him that I'm ready

[00:10:15] because he's like, hey, I want you to accumulate points.

[00:10:17] I want you to show me that you can manage your body.

[00:10:20] I want you to show me that you can dominate out there

[00:10:22] on the world tour so that when I play with you,

[00:10:26] we're not starting at the bottom.

[00:10:27] We're starting to show that we can get in there

[00:10:30] and start grinding and get some wins right off the bat.

[00:10:35] And now here we are at 2024 and that was five years ago

[00:10:39] and I look at these last five years

[00:10:41] and I'm so proud of the choice that I made.

[00:10:44] I'm so happy that Sam gave me that phone call

[00:10:47] and so much has happened in the last five years

[00:10:51] and the last two years

[00:10:52] in the last eight months that I wouldn't change a thing.

[00:10:58] You guys qualified for Paris on the very last day.

[00:11:02] The Olympic Day, the annual day to celebrate the Olympics

[00:11:08] is when we qualified.

[00:11:09] You were playing a tournament in Mexico.

[00:11:12] You swept that tournament, which is incredible

[00:11:15] and I noticed something in that tournament

[00:11:16] as I was watching it was this level of childlike joy

[00:11:23] between the both of you,

[00:11:24] both in your interactions with each other

[00:11:26] and just in your moments of happiness

[00:11:29] when you scored a point

[00:11:32] and you just celebrated it to yourself.

[00:11:34] There was just this childlike joy

[00:11:35] that came out of both of you.

[00:11:37] I imagine over the course of several years,

[00:11:40] that's not something that's happening regularly.

[00:11:43] What were some of the challenges

[00:11:46] that you guys had to face along the way

[00:11:48] that made you doubt that the Olympics

[00:11:50] was even going to be a thing?

[00:11:54] There were a few.

[00:11:55] You were like, I feel good for you.

[00:12:01] It was a really really hard road.

[00:12:04] We had to make a lot of really big choices.

[00:12:07] Big decisions like path altering decisions.

[00:12:10] We actually just had our team debrief a few days ago

[00:12:14] where we sort of reflected on some of those decisions

[00:12:17] where-

[00:12:18] Those are always fun.

[00:12:19] Yeah, exactly and I think it's like yeah anyways.

[00:12:23] Those are for sure important,

[00:12:24] but there, I think the biggest thing that was sort of

[00:12:32] a barrier for us, especially at first

[00:12:34] was the ability for both of us to sort of stay healthy.

[00:12:38] And you know, I was dealing with a knee injury early on

[00:12:42] and Dan was dealing with back stuff, knee stuff,

[00:12:46] shoulder stuff, sort of chronically more

[00:12:51] and a big part of our ability to sort of

[00:12:56] work through those issues was our ability,

[00:12:58] was finding ways to manage it

[00:13:01] and learning that like level of professionalism

[00:13:05] that it's not a nine to five job.

[00:13:08] It's a 24 hour job and it goes on constantly

[00:13:11] because the second you sort of let your foot off the gas

[00:13:13] and you ask this to any Olympian is they'll confirm

[00:13:16] like everyone else is just catching up

[00:13:19] or going farther ahead.

[00:13:20] So it really comes down to who works the hardest

[00:13:23] and work the hardest doesn't mean when you're on the court

[00:13:26] you're working hard, like that's an absolute bare minimum.

[00:13:30] It's the things that you do away from the court

[00:13:32] that I think a lot of people don't understand

[00:13:34] how much goes into that, not only from the physical side

[00:13:38] but the mental side and the organization side

[00:13:40] and especially in Beach Volleyball

[00:13:43] we are incredibly independent athletes.

[00:13:45] We have to do all of our own travel.

[00:13:47] We have to do all of our own bookings,

[00:13:48] organize our own training, constant like we're the center

[00:13:52] of a lot of people who are invested in our success.

[00:13:58] So our therapist, our strength and conditioning coach

[00:14:00] our mental performance coach, our personal coach

[00:14:02] the national team head coach

[00:14:05] all of these people sort of rotate around us

[00:14:07] and we have to coordinate and communicate with everyone

[00:14:10] check a lot of boxes do things that people are asking

[00:14:13] it's grindy, it's grindy.

[00:14:15] And Dan and myself figuring out how to keep ourselves

[00:14:21] healthy and on the court was a pivotal part of that

[00:14:25] but that connects like for critical people

[00:14:28] and making sure everyone's on the same page

[00:14:30] and the second someone slips off the same page

[00:14:33] you get hurt because you're doing too much in workout

[00:14:35] and not enough on the sand or vice versa

[00:14:38] or the therapist doesn't really communicate well

[00:14:41] to the strength and conditioning coach

[00:14:42] what the injury is.

[00:14:43] So you're actually exacerbating the injury

[00:14:46] during a training or a workout session

[00:14:48] and these things seem sort of easy to coordinate conceptually

[00:14:53] but when it comes to practice is during constant flux

[00:14:56] and you're working on different things every other day

[00:14:58] and the load even within our week is tapering

[00:15:03] and loading and you're doing conditioning

[00:15:06] and everything's changing

[00:15:07] because you're moving closer to a tournament

[00:15:08] so your workouts are changing.

[00:15:10] So it's a lot of managing.

[00:15:12] That's a lot of stuff to manage

[00:15:13] and on top of that we have to sort of ourselves

[00:15:17] be mentally ready to play

[00:15:19] and that's a whole different ball game

[00:15:21] and then sort of on that note

[00:15:24] is creating the right team around you.

[00:15:26] So making sure that you have the right coach in place

[00:15:29] making sure that the strength and conditioning coach

[00:15:32] is working well with you.

[00:15:33] We've had debates and discussions

[00:15:36] about all of those things including therapy

[00:15:40] to make sure that we're feeling healthy

[00:15:42] and we're having the right therapist

[00:15:43] who's making us feel the right way.

[00:15:45] So.

[00:15:46] I gotta ask you a question on that.

[00:15:51] All of that sounds a lot for one person.

[00:15:55] When there's two of you like any relationship

[00:15:59] there's going to be a level of,

[00:16:02] hey are we doing this?

[00:16:04] Do you wanna do this?

[00:16:06] What's the other person's commitment level to this?

[00:16:08] Does it match mine?

[00:16:09] Am I matching theirs?

[00:16:11] How do you balance a partnership

[00:16:15] while working towards the epitome of sports in the Olympics?

[00:16:21] There's egos, there's pride, there's emotions,

[00:16:25] there's down days, there's great days

[00:16:27] and you're essentially hoping just like any other sports team

[00:16:30] that it all just perfectly lines up

[00:16:33] at the exact right moment.

[00:16:35] How did you guys balance those?

[00:16:40] It took everything in me and in us truly to do that.

[00:16:46] You just said there's great days, okay days, bad days.

[00:16:50] There's a quote that says days come in thirds.

[00:16:53] Like it came in many days and definitely maybe in eighths.

[00:16:58] There was great days where we had solid training,

[00:17:02] great communication, great energy

[00:17:04] and there was very, very bad days

[00:17:06] like you said about egos and clashing

[00:17:10] and not communicating well

[00:17:11] and not taking the moment to say something

[00:17:14] and holding on to it,

[00:17:15] leading to resentment to the next practice

[00:17:17] and then that builds up.

[00:17:19] That was constantly happening.

[00:17:21] Sam knows me so well, I know him so well.

[00:17:24] Getting a coach involved, getting that team,

[00:17:27] that village to be a part of all that type of communication

[00:17:30] and energy takes a lot.

[00:17:32] And on the bad days, you're not in a great state of mind

[00:17:38] because it's a bad day, it's a bad training day

[00:17:41] and we clash and egos would clash all the time,

[00:17:45] creating not the best environments,

[00:17:47] not the best communication.

[00:17:50] And trust me, it got very dark

[00:17:52] and it got very heavy where we needed days and weeks

[00:17:56] to figure out how can we get back

[00:17:59] to the goal that we all had in mind

[00:18:01] which was let's make the Olympics together

[00:18:05] and putting all that negativity

[00:18:08] and heaviness and resentment aside.

[00:18:11] And Sam took a lot of leadership in that on our team

[00:18:14] was to know that our intentions were always good

[00:18:19] to push each other beyond the limits

[00:18:22] that we think we're capable of

[00:18:24] and not take anything personally

[00:18:26] even though at times, that's all it felt like.

[00:18:29] You were getting attacked, unheard.

[00:18:31] The sacrifices you were making

[00:18:33] didn't feel like the team responded to that

[00:18:36] or didn't know about that

[00:18:37] or you wanted to share that but you felt like you couldn't

[00:18:40] because at times Sam felt like all his energy

[00:18:44] need to be dedicated towards my mindset

[00:18:47] for weeks and months at times.

[00:18:49] So it's a lot of fluctuation, a lot of communication

[00:18:54] and the highest of highs and the lowest of lows.

[00:18:59] Were you comfortable holding that on your shoulders?

[00:19:04] Having the prior experience walking into this,

[00:19:07] knowing what it took to get to Rio

[00:19:12] and then planning for Paris,

[00:19:15] knowing what's involved

[00:19:16] and knowing that you had to take a bigger step here.

[00:19:20] Were you comfortable holding that kind of responsibility?

[00:19:25] I'm comfortable doing the right thing

[00:19:28] and I'm comfortable part of being an athlete

[00:19:32] is getting comfortable, being uncomfortable.

[00:19:35] So however you sort of interpret that

[00:19:38] where that's sort of part of the job

[00:19:41] and I knew that was like implicit

[00:19:43] in being a leader on this team

[00:19:45] is sometimes doing things that are difficult.

[00:19:49] We do it every day.

[00:19:50] So yeah, like sometimes you have to hold space

[00:19:55] for your partner when that's not a thing

[00:19:59] you're necessarily comfortable with

[00:20:01] or the thing that you wanna be doing

[00:20:02] right at that moment in time.

[00:20:06] I think like the key thing that I got

[00:20:10] of what Dan just said is like,

[00:20:12] we all need to come from a place

[00:20:15] where we're trying to understand each other

[00:20:16] and I think that's a universal truth in this world.

[00:20:21] Transcend sport and that rule of thirds

[00:20:25] was also something super key in keeping me sane

[00:20:29] where I brought that to the team

[00:20:30] and I was like rule of thirds,

[00:20:32] one of every three days is gonna be bad,

[00:20:35] one of every three days is gonna be great

[00:20:36] and one of every three days

[00:20:38] is gonna be like sort of the average.

[00:20:41] And if you're hitting two out of three days bad,

[00:20:45] you're pushing too hard.

[00:20:46] If you're hitting two out of three days good,

[00:20:49] it's training's too easy.

[00:20:50] So you need to be sort of dividing that up

[00:20:53] to be keeping your sanity as you're going through this

[00:20:58] so it's not all bad

[00:20:59] and it's not too easy where it's all good.

[00:21:01] So it's that goldilocks zone of improvement in my eyes.

[00:21:08] So I think we had to constantly be reflecting on that

[00:21:11] and I think your coach is someone

[00:21:13] who really needs to have his finger on the pulse

[00:21:17] of the team and sort of understand

[00:21:19] where we're at each day.

[00:21:22] So he can sort of manipulate and adjust practice

[00:21:25] to get us into that mindset

[00:21:27] where we are having a good day today.

[00:21:30] Just modify down, make it easy for us baby please.

[00:21:33] I beg of you.

[00:21:34] We don't need another grind.

[00:21:37] But yeah or scale it up.

[00:21:39] And for you.

[00:21:40] So it sounds like it's very much like

[00:21:43] there's a mindset that has to be developed

[00:21:46] and nurtured throughout this process to keep you going

[00:21:50] and you have to balance your mental toughness

[00:21:53] and wellness with your emotional toughness

[00:21:56] and wellness with your physical toughness and wellness.

[00:21:59] And you're trying to balance all of these things

[00:22:01] while also trying not to fold under the pressures

[00:22:03] of expectations being set on you externally

[00:22:07] and that's not even to speak

[00:22:09] to the massive internal expectations

[00:22:11] that I'm pretty sure you guys set on yourselves as well.

[00:22:16] I wanna go to the physical element.

[00:22:19] You both talked about injuries.

[00:22:22] Igor can you do me a kindness and just,

[00:22:24] so this is for context for anyone who's listening.

[00:22:28] This is a video from your game against,

[00:22:31] I think it was Chili,

[00:22:33] which was your fourth game, right?

[00:22:37] You won, sorry, you lost the first two,

[00:22:41] won the third and this one if you won it

[00:22:44] you advanced forward.

[00:22:47] So Igor can we hit play for a moment?

[00:23:32] Good Lord.

[00:23:33] I haven't watched that.

[00:23:38] Everything happened there.

[00:23:41] Everything.

[00:23:44] Talk me through it.

[00:23:47] Well, throughout the entire journey,

[00:23:54] Sam knows and I know about him,

[00:23:55] how we pushed each other to the limits all the time.

[00:23:59] He helped me do that.

[00:24:03] And it's a 24 seven job

[00:24:07] and leading up to that point,

[00:24:09] I look back on that moment

[00:24:14] and it's not the way we wanted to end.

[00:24:18] I rather like have been able to fight

[00:24:21] and do our best and lose to a team that's better than us.

[00:24:25] That's how we imagine going there, never this moment.

[00:24:28] No one wants to witness that moment.

[00:24:30] No one wants to feel that moment.

[00:24:31] For me, the one who made the call

[00:24:33] and for him who had to support that call

[00:24:38] it was the right decision to make.

[00:24:40] I couldn't move.

[00:24:42] I was feeling so much physical pain,

[00:24:44] so much emotional pain

[00:24:46] and I'm trying to even allow the space

[00:24:49] of how Sam's feeling,

[00:24:50] trying to be empathetic when

[00:24:52] that's not even on my priority list.

[00:24:55] So it again, it's a fluctuation of emotions seeing that

[00:25:04] because it just brings me back to that exact moment

[00:25:08] where it ended in a way that we didn't want it to end

[00:25:15] and at times that is just the moment

[00:25:19] that was captured by the world.

[00:25:23] But at times four or five times throughout this journey

[00:25:27] I felt exactly like that, exactly like that

[00:25:30] where I'm in tears and I can't communicate

[00:25:36] or I can't really tell Sam and our coach how I'm feeling

[00:25:41] and how I feel like I've pushed myself

[00:25:43] beyond my body's limits.

[00:25:45] So it's so sad that it happened at the Olympics

[00:25:50] but yeah, it's tough to watch.

[00:25:56] So what exactly happened?

[00:25:58] What was the injury there?

[00:26:02] I've been managing a bum shoulder since December of 2023

[00:26:08] and it caused a lot of hurdles

[00:26:11] and a lot of tough conversations

[00:26:14] and management from physio and our coach and our load

[00:26:17] and the focus has been on the shoulder

[00:26:19] for such a long time that this was kind of out of nowhere.

[00:26:25] My low back was feeling great

[00:26:26] at what didn't seem to be a problem at all

[00:26:30] but earlier that morning just a funky

[00:26:33] outside lunge movement caused my back

[00:26:35] to go into full spasm and started to apply

[00:26:39] a lot of pressure on my spine where I couldn't move

[00:26:41] without being upright and stiff and straight.

[00:26:48] Looking back, as Sam said, you look back

[00:26:51] at how you would wanna change things

[00:26:53] or how could you have done things to make this not happen?

[00:26:57] And I think maybe the focus for me mentally and physically

[00:27:01] and the team was so much put onto my right shoulder

[00:27:04] that my shoulder just prioritized everything.

[00:27:08] I was constantly popping meds and doing exercises

[00:27:12] and getting treatment to try to maintain my shoulder

[00:27:14] so when we're on the court for 45 minutes,

[00:27:17] I can perform without it being a distraction

[00:27:20] and then boom, my low back just decides to say,

[00:27:24] hey, I'm here too and I'm done with you.

[00:27:28] So that's what happened.

[00:27:34] It's a lot of emotion in that video.

[00:27:37] There will always be in that video.

[00:27:42] Could only imagine.

[00:27:43] You can see it on my face.

[00:27:47] You can see what Sam's going through

[00:27:48] and he probably looks at himself

[00:27:50] and feels his own types of way of his emotions

[00:27:52] and looks at me and I hope that he can see

[00:27:55] that I pushed myself beyond the limit

[00:27:57] because I know I did.

[00:28:00] And it'll always be tough to see

[00:28:05] but it was the right decision to make.

[00:28:07] I could not have won that game.

[00:28:09] I could not have performed

[00:28:10] and just at the beginning of coming in here,

[00:28:15] seeing that clip, it's a fluctuation

[00:28:18] of the highest of highs and the lowest of lows

[00:28:20] because you're on the world stage,

[00:28:23] the biggest tournament in the world

[00:28:24] that Sam and I were able to get there and achieve

[00:28:26] but yet, I'm not gonna say it's the lowest of lows

[00:28:30] because it's not.

[00:28:31] It's just a lot, a lot of everything.

[00:28:37] Have you reconciled it?

[00:28:40] Yeah, I've been reflecting on it

[00:28:43] and again, just to repeat looking back at what could I have done,

[00:28:47] should I've done more work on my low back

[00:28:49] and just play okay, my low back's tight

[00:28:51] but it's nothing compared to my shoulder.

[00:28:53] So it'll go away.

[00:28:54] I'll do my activation, I'll do my core

[00:28:56] and I'll feel fine.

[00:28:59] So yeah, it'll take more time for sure

[00:29:03] but it doesn't take away.

[00:29:05] That was a moment in a tough choice to make

[00:29:09] on the world stage but reconciling with that moment,

[00:29:14] I honestly, the reflection of the journey

[00:29:16] and the 99% of what got us there in the first place

[00:29:20] and having similar moments like that

[00:29:22] throughout Sam and I's career and partnership,

[00:29:25] that's just one of them.

[00:29:27] Unfortunately, but those moments for me happened a lot

[00:29:31] and it just sucked to have happened there.

[00:29:36] Sam, I gotta ask, when you're competing at a high level

[00:29:44] and you don't play to your fullest,

[00:29:46] you don't play well for whatever reason,

[00:29:50] you can kind of take mental notes

[00:29:51] and go okay, this is why I didn't play well

[00:29:53] to an earlier point that you made.

[00:29:55] When you're playing in a pair

[00:29:58] and an unfortunate circumstance arises with your teammate

[00:30:02] that essentially means that even though you might have

[00:30:05] been competing at the level that you wanted to,

[00:30:08] you just simply can't continue anymore.

[00:30:10] I'm just curious, how do you feel in that moment?

[00:30:18] Yeah, like a mix of course.

[00:30:24] I think I was in shock still.

[00:30:28] Like you're watching yourself move around and do this,

[00:30:34] like you're not even in your own body type of thing

[00:30:36] because it was what we wanted.

[00:30:39] We were in a place where we wanted to be doing

[00:30:42] what we loved and not being able to compete.

[00:30:44] I mean, it's the weirdest mix of emotions

[00:30:49] I think I've ever had,

[00:30:50] where I'm so empathetic

[00:30:53] because I'm seeing everything unfold.

[00:30:55] I'm there for every moment of it, pretty much,

[00:30:58] other than when I think you were in the polyclinic

[00:31:00] getting treatment.

[00:31:00] I was with you every other moment

[00:31:05] all the way to, yeah, like deciding to pull out.

[00:31:11] And then, so I'm so empathetic for what he's going through

[00:31:15] because I see how much pain he's in.

[00:31:17] I see how hard we're trying to make it

[00:31:19] so we can compete, just compete

[00:31:22] and step on the court.

[00:31:25] And then there's the other part of me,

[00:31:28] the more selfish part of me,

[00:31:30] where it's like watching your partner's ankle just get rolled

[00:31:36] freak accident at the net.

[00:31:37] Happens all the time, part of sport,

[00:31:39] but you feel robbed of the chance to compete.

[00:31:43] And I think that's the emotion

[00:31:45] that I've had to battle with the most

[00:31:47] because we work so hard to get there

[00:31:52] and then we are both robbed of that.

[00:31:55] The only difference is I have zero control

[00:32:00] and Dan has limited control in a sense that,

[00:32:03] like these things happen and it's part of sport

[00:32:06] and it's not that he's not trying.

[00:32:08] Of course he's trying, we all recognize that

[00:32:11] and I'm sure he feels robbed.

[00:32:13] Why is my body failing me?

[00:32:14] It's robbing me of the chance to do this,

[00:32:18] which is like the ultimate

[00:32:22] sporting event for our sport.

[00:32:26] So yeah, like those two weirdly contrasting emotions

[00:32:30] where it's like frustration and anger and disappointment

[00:32:33] and empathy and caring and love

[00:32:36] because we're brothers, we've been through

[00:32:37] all of this together.

[00:32:39] So you never, I wouldn't wanna see my opponent

[00:32:43] that happened to my opponent.

[00:32:44] They weren't happy that they had to,

[00:32:46] they're happy there,

[00:32:47] they're passing to the next round,

[00:32:48] but nobody wants to win in that fashion.

[00:32:52] It's against the whole spirit of what the Olympics is,

[00:32:55] which is competition and unity

[00:32:57] and countries coming together and celebrating sport.

[00:33:01] There is no celebration of sport there.

[00:33:05] That's sadness.

[00:33:06] I think everyone in the crowd,

[00:33:08] everyone watching on TV was experiencing the same thing.

[00:33:10] They wanna see us compete.

[00:33:12] They wanna see us have joy on the court

[00:33:14] the way you are expressing that we had joy in Mexico.

[00:33:17] It was an elimination round.

[00:33:19] All of those Mexican,

[00:33:20] all those matches in Mexico where you were seeing that joy

[00:33:23] was elimination rounds, do or die moments.

[00:33:26] We had that against Austria.

[00:33:28] There was a ton of joy

[00:33:29] because it was a do or die moment.

[00:33:30] Hey, let's just go out there and let it rip.

[00:33:33] And we couldn't let it rip.

[00:33:35] And I think that's, it's sad.

[00:33:38] It's deeply saddening.

[00:33:39] There's a lot of healing that I think

[00:33:41] everyone's gonna have to do

[00:33:42] including our coach who was out there

[00:33:45] grinding with us the entire time

[00:33:47] and yeah, I don't know.

[00:33:50] It was, I mean, I do know it was horrible.

[00:33:52] It was horrible for everybody, but yeah,

[00:33:56] just a weird mix to try and navigate, I guess.

[00:33:59] And when you hear Sam talk about

[00:34:02] the concept of feeling robbed by the moment,

[00:34:08] what goes through your mind when you hear that?

[00:34:15] I agree.

[00:34:17] It was robbed from him.

[00:34:18] It was robbed from our coach.

[00:34:20] It was robbed from me.

[00:34:21] It was robbed from all those fans

[00:34:24] that decided to pay money and come watch that,

[00:34:27] our game to all our community and country

[00:34:30] that tuned in to watch.

[00:34:32] I didn't want that to happen.

[00:34:34] I didn't.

[00:34:37] When it happened in the morning,

[00:34:39] I was so scared.

[00:34:41] I was so scared.

[00:34:44] I was like, this can't be happening right now.

[00:34:46] It can't be.

[00:34:47] There's no way.

[00:34:49] And then just, yeah.

[00:34:53] The pain I was in, I was fighting it,

[00:34:58] trying to not let it be real

[00:35:04] and do everything that I was being told to do

[00:35:07] from all the professional staff in our support system.

[00:35:12] Every second was a lot.

[00:35:15] And there was a lot of seconds leading

[00:35:16] from in the morning to that match.

[00:35:18] And if it was just me,

[00:35:23] I probably would have not have showed up to that court

[00:35:28] and not played and been in that moment

[00:35:32] for the whole world to see.

[00:35:33] Cause I knew there's no way that I could perform,

[00:35:38] let alone I had a hard time just walking onto the court.

[00:35:43] And Sam has done so much for me as this partnership.

[00:35:46] Our coach and coaches have done so much for us

[00:35:50] that I literally had to do it for them first.

[00:35:54] And it was more than about me.

[00:35:56] And I went on the court and I wanted it to just disappear.

[00:36:02] I'm like, oh, I'm gonna feel the energy of the court.

[00:36:04] I'm gonna feel being on the best venue at the Olympics.

[00:36:08] I'm gonna take it all in and it didn't happen.

[00:36:14] And even when Sam put up his best serve of the year,

[00:36:19] he thunderbolted a jump serve.

[00:36:23] I was like for one second, I'm like, oh, he can do it.

[00:36:29] He can do it for us.

[00:36:31] I can just be a pylon.

[00:36:36] But so I did have that one second of like, whoa.

[00:36:40] Like we're gonna take this to the next level.

[00:36:44] But I couldn't, there were so many things going in my mind.

[00:36:49] It wasn't about volleyball in that moment.

[00:36:50] It was about Sam, it was about our coach, Sir John

[00:36:52] and it was about the country.

[00:36:55] And I didn't even like saying those words,

[00:36:58] I couldn't do it.

[00:36:58] I could have kept playing.

[00:37:01] We wouldn't have won though.

[00:37:03] And I would have-

[00:37:03] Probably shouldn't have either.

[00:37:05] And I would have put myself into a position

[00:37:07] that I could have hurt myself for the rest of my life.

[00:37:10] And I'm still struggling today just trying to recover,

[00:37:12] but just seeing that moment and that clip again brings

[00:37:16] just as much as emotional pain

[00:37:17] as the physical pain that I was going through.

[00:37:20] So-

[00:37:21] And for more context, the injury was so severe

[00:37:24] that you basically were bedridden

[00:37:27] for what, two, three days afterwards?

[00:37:30] 36 hours after that happened, I was, yeah, I was,

[00:37:36] it was a hard time.

[00:37:37] It was a very hard time.

[00:37:38] I-

[00:37:39] If I was a fly on the wall, what would I have seen?

[00:37:44] You would have been traumatized.

[00:37:47] It was-

[00:37:49] There was no ego couldn't exist, pride couldn't exist.

[00:37:54] The only thing that existed was pain,

[00:37:58] emotional pain and physical pain.

[00:38:01] And I'm like, I didn't even want my fiance

[00:38:06] to be in their room there with me

[00:38:07] because I knew she would have started to cry

[00:38:09] and trying to help.

[00:38:10] So having Sam there was probably the best person

[00:38:14] to be there because at least he's seen it

[00:38:16] and experienced it before, not to that extent of course,

[00:38:19] but I was in so much pain.

[00:38:24] I FaceTimed Shanice, my fiance on the computer

[00:38:27] and I just wanted her to be in there

[00:38:30] and support with me as I fell asleep and it worked.

[00:38:35] If you were a fly on the wall at 3 a.m. in the morning,

[00:38:38] you would have seen me try to go to the bathroom

[00:38:41] and fall face down on the floor

[00:38:43] and be stuck there for an hour.

[00:38:46] After the hour went by, I was able to drag myself

[00:38:49] closer to my bed and then

[00:38:54] I'm gonna turn this powerful moment

[00:38:56] into more of a humorous moment.

[00:38:59] I'm not the greatest sleeper.

[00:39:02] I moan, I snore.

[00:39:04] So Sam has to put in his headphones

[00:39:06] and a little sleep mask in order for him to not hear me.

[00:39:11] And then in that moment when I was on the floor,

[00:39:15] I felt helpless, completely helpless

[00:39:18] and I was calling out for Sam.

[00:39:20] I was calling his name because I needed help.

[00:39:23] And I just, in that moment,

[00:39:27] I was like okay, Sam's not here.

[00:39:29] He's going through his own amount of pain

[00:39:32] that he's experiencing and he's probably,

[00:39:34] with his fiancee who has been there with us

[00:39:37] for all of this journey.

[00:39:39] And I'm like okay, he's there,

[00:39:41] he's getting filled up, he's dealing it with his way.

[00:39:44] I'm here alone and this is gonna be a very hard

[00:39:47] and struggling moment

[00:39:48] and probably the most struggling moment in my life.

[00:39:51] And in that moment I found another layer of strength

[00:39:56] that I will carry with me for the rest of my life.

[00:40:01] And I just sat there until 8.30 in the morning

[00:40:04] until the doctors and Sam came and people woke up

[00:40:07] and they were able to treat me

[00:40:10] and to get me out of spasm

[00:40:13] and to put me on a lot of meds.

[00:40:16] And it was excruciating, it was painful.

[00:40:21] And over the course of a week after that

[00:40:24] where there was good days and bad days

[00:40:26] and now there's more good days and bad days

[00:40:28] but I'm still trying to recover

[00:40:29] and get my back into a spot

[00:40:31] where at least my daily motions of life

[00:40:33] can be not painful, let alone

[00:40:35] I'm not gonna step onto a court for a few months for sure

[00:40:38] to make sure that this is properly dealt with.

[00:40:41] But I think that fly would have stayed on that wall

[00:40:48] and not move the entire time.

[00:40:51] And I kind of wish you could have been a fly

[00:40:53] on the wall, cause at least I know

[00:40:54] my brother Samir would have been there.

[00:40:59] But I could talk about that moment

[00:41:01] in this month's depth for the rest of my life

[00:41:04] cause I know exactly what happened there

[00:41:06] and I know exactly how I felt.

[00:41:07] And when I look back and go through five, 10 years from now

[00:41:13] and you ask me that same question

[00:41:14] I will answer it the exact same

[00:41:16] and probably with this much emotion

[00:41:17] knowing that I can just go back

[00:41:19] to that exact same moment and realize

[00:41:21] even though it was the worst sporting moment for me

[00:41:27] cause we weren't able to accomplish

[00:41:29] what we wanted to accomplish

[00:41:31] and then having those moments of being stuck on the floor

[00:41:34] and almost pissing myself

[00:41:37] those moments will stick with me for a lifetime

[00:41:41] and those are the type of moments where hopefully

[00:41:44] I'll be able to look at that video clip

[00:41:46] of us having to afford our match

[00:41:48] and realize I did give it my all

[00:41:50] and I went through so much in order to get there

[00:41:52] and I hope Sam knows for the rest of his life

[00:41:55] and his career that he feels that exact same way

[00:41:58] cause I was in a lot of pain but wow.

[00:42:06] Olympics ain't always chalked up

[00:42:08] to be what people want it to be.

[00:42:11] There's a lot of stuff going on behind.

[00:42:13] Well, I was going to say just listening

[00:42:15] to the both of you speak

[00:42:16] at we see this right?

[00:42:20] We see the flashy opening ceremony.

[00:42:25] We see the games, we see the highlight reels,

[00:42:28] we see the podiums

[00:42:31] and I was reflecting on this before this conversation.

[00:42:36] We don't see anything that's happened

[00:42:38] in the last five years leading up to this moment.

[00:42:43] Without having any of this context

[00:42:45] if I were just to turn on the TV

[00:42:46] and watch this match and then see that you got injured

[00:42:49] I would think oh maybe he just heard himself

[00:42:51] in the play how unfortunate.

[00:42:54] Flip the channel, let's go watch another Canadian do something.

[00:42:59] I'm wondering if there's one or two things

[00:43:02] that you can think of that if you can share with people

[00:43:06] hey this is what really goes on behind the scenes

[00:43:09] that you don't see in the life of an Olympian

[00:43:11] to compete to this level.

[00:43:13] What would those things be?

[00:43:15] Because I know you guys are not necessarily

[00:43:16] making a lot of money being an Olympian.

[00:43:19] We've had this conversation in the past

[00:43:21] where for the most part you're relying on sponsors

[00:43:24] and self-funding or funding your travel

[00:43:26] and all of those things so you're really doing this

[00:43:29] because you're passionate and you love it.

[00:43:32] And to some degree there's a level of craziness in there

[00:43:34] but you need a little bit of crazy in your life.

[00:43:37] What are people not seeing about the life of an Olympian?

[00:43:41] I think the main thing for me

[00:43:43] that people don't fully grasp is playing

[00:43:47] is the easiest part of our day, of our week, of our month.

[00:43:53] Like competition is easy.

[00:43:55] The reason why it's easy is because when we're training

[00:43:59] you train harder to make the match easier

[00:44:05] and when you use that principle

[00:44:07] there is really no limit on how hard you should be training

[00:44:11] because the better you are in training

[00:44:13] and the better that makes you

[00:44:15] the higher your game average performance rises.

[00:44:22] So this is like the most fun

[00:44:24] and you see how stressful it can be at times

[00:44:26] and how frustrating all the emotions

[00:44:28] that it can bring up at times.

[00:44:30] So people say, oh when you watch athletes perform

[00:44:33] it's really like the proverbial tip of the iceberg

[00:44:36] of all the work that they're doing

[00:44:39] but it's also like the easiest work that we're doing.

[00:44:42] Our conditioning is done to expand our capacity in games.

[00:44:48] Our training is done to expand our capacity in games.

[00:44:50] Everything, including our emotional stress

[00:44:52] is like we try and target our weakest elements constantly

[00:44:57] because we know our opponents are going to.

[00:44:59] So we're also working on the stuff

[00:45:01] that they're the worst at.

[00:45:03] So it's not a ton of fun.

[00:45:06] It's fun competing and it's fun winning

[00:45:08] but you have to be obsessed with the challenge

[00:45:11] and I think the athletes who are

[00:45:16] are like almost fundamentally miserable

[00:45:18] because they're putting themselves in the state

[00:45:21] of like battling their misery constantly

[00:45:24] to expand their capacity.

[00:45:26] We talk about extending our wick.

[00:45:29] So allowing that candle to burn for longer

[00:45:31] and that's what we do when we do conditioning

[00:45:34] is we're extending our wick.

[00:45:35] It was like sort of our team motto for years.

[00:45:40] Yeah, like and then we're not doing it for a ton of money

[00:45:43] and we're at the top of our field in the world.

[00:45:46] So we're an Olympian, you know,

[00:45:48] you could imagine if I were a salesperson

[00:45:50] in the top 0.01% of the world population

[00:45:54] I'd be like a billionaire and be a fucking so rich.

[00:45:57] He's so fucking rich

[00:45:58] I wouldn't have to worry about money again.

[00:46:01] But we're out here competing doing our passion for some

[00:46:07] and doesn't always pay off.

[00:46:09] And there's roadblocks everywhere

[00:46:10] and you're not, you know,

[00:46:12] you try to enjoy the journey

[00:46:14] and we talk about it a lot is like,

[00:46:16] you know, enjoying the journey part of it

[00:46:17] not just the Olympics

[00:46:18] because this is the exact stuff that could happen

[00:46:20] to any team or losing or not breaking pool

[00:46:23] or, you know, losing your last match of the tournament.

[00:46:25] Really only one maybe two teams go home happy

[00:46:29] with the gold medal, right?

[00:46:33] So yeah, you have to learn how to enjoy

[00:46:35] that grindiness of the process.

[00:46:37] It's really like that's the mentality

[00:46:40] that produces champions or produces just like

[00:46:43] happy Olympians, which you don't tend to see a ton of

[00:46:48] because they won't talk about what I'm talking about

[00:46:51] which is the grindy part of it.

[00:46:53] Everyone just sees the prestige of the Olympian

[00:46:55] and the fun.

[00:46:56] Oh my gosh, everyone knows you now.

[00:46:58] Look at this, you know,

[00:47:01] one of my mentors who's Marquis,

[00:47:03] he used to compete for Canada internationally.

[00:47:06] He's a three time Olympian and a bronze medalist

[00:47:08] and he told me this story when I was 16.

[00:47:11] He said, you know, we went to the Olympics.

[00:47:13] We won the bronze medal and we were like,

[00:47:15] that's it?

[00:47:16] Did all this work?

[00:47:17] And we feel like this?

[00:47:18] Like that's weird.

[00:47:20] Like it's not everything that youth hope it's to be

[00:47:25] and it sort of pivoted my mindset to be like,

[00:47:28] maybe I should try and enjoy myself while doing it more.

[00:47:32] Which is sometimes hard to do, but when you ask what,

[00:47:36] pull the curtain back on the Olympian a little bit

[00:47:40] and that's not all doom and gloom.

[00:47:42] Like there's a lot of fun parts about it.

[00:47:44] But that's something that I think a lot of people

[00:47:46] don't understand about professional sport.

[00:47:48] They say, oh, you're gonna have this luxury lifestyle.

[00:47:51] Well, usually get in the cheapest Airbnb we can find

[00:47:54] because I'm making that much money

[00:47:56] is a little grindy.

[00:47:58] But, you know, if you're with the right person

[00:48:00] and Dan and I had a ton of fun on this journey,

[00:48:04] it makes it all sort of worth it in the end.

[00:48:06] Like you gain so much experience,

[00:48:08] you gain all these tools, these wonderful skills

[00:48:10] that you don't know if you're gonna translate

[00:48:12] into real life or not.

[00:48:13] We're keeping a fucking balloon off the ground here.

[00:48:16] There's a lot of things that we're learning on the way

[00:48:17] and I think that's like the wonderful part of it.

[00:48:20] So there's like the tough part, the grindy part

[00:48:22] that people don't know about

[00:48:24] and then sort of the other side of that.

[00:48:27] Yeah, I mean, I enjoyed it, did you?

[00:48:30] I did too.

[00:48:31] I did too.

[00:48:34] The challenge was daily.

[00:48:36] Sometimes it was easier, but it was still a challenge

[00:48:39] and sometimes it was some,

[00:48:41] the hardest challenges I've ever had to face in life

[00:48:43] and I wouldn't change that.

[00:48:44] And we showed up practice after practice after practice

[00:48:51] and that's kind of what you have to do.

[00:48:53] You just show up, you show up on a bad day,

[00:48:57] on a good day, you show up.

[00:49:00] And then learning from him, especially the first year,

[00:49:04] I'm a sponge and he's like a very disciplined,

[00:49:08] hard work ethic, like strong mental liquid

[00:49:10] that I just sponged up

[00:49:12] where you just show up every single day

[00:49:14] and I'm out of the challenge and put in the work

[00:49:18] and it becomes routine.

[00:49:22] It just doesn't become a choice or a thought anymore.

[00:49:25] It just, you just do it.

[00:49:27] It just happens.

[00:49:28] It's kind of like, I think I showed it with you.

[00:49:30] You come home after a long day or even partying

[00:49:33] and you're drunk, you still brush your teeth.

[00:49:36] It's just a routine.

[00:49:37] You brush your teeth before you go to bed.

[00:49:40] So there's bad days, injury days, tired days,

[00:49:44] crying days, and then you run conditioning.

[00:49:49] I can't sleep.

[00:49:51] I'm in separate beds with my fiance.

[00:49:53] My shoulder is waking me up every single day,

[00:49:56] multiple times at night

[00:49:58] and I show up for practice at 8 a.m.

[00:50:00] I might not be able to hit.

[00:50:02] I might not be able to do certain things

[00:50:03] but I can pass, I can set.

[00:50:06] I have to show up even if I don't want to

[00:50:08] because my commitment is to Sam to this team

[00:50:12] and having to share all of those thoughts

[00:50:16] and processes and pain in a way

[00:50:19] to hopefully get people to understand

[00:50:21] is a challenge on its own

[00:50:22] and I've failed multiple times speaking to Sam

[00:50:25] and speaking to our coach.

[00:50:27] And with his knee injury and seeing him freak out

[00:50:30] just by doing a little pivot

[00:50:32] and his knee just blows up

[00:50:34] and he has to like get off the court

[00:50:36] or else he feels threatened, you show up.

[00:50:39] And seeing those moments and sharing those moments

[00:50:43] we know that we gave it our all in the moments

[00:50:46] and then you look two weeks later, a month later

[00:50:49] and you realize you've got a whole process.

[00:50:51] Guess what?

[00:50:52] Without even knowing it, you've extended your wick.

[00:50:55] You just don't know it.

[00:50:57] You've extended it.

[00:50:58] It's a beautiful analogy.

[00:50:59] I like this concept of extending your wick.

[00:51:04] What's next?

[00:51:11] I don't know yet.

[00:51:12] There's lots of things that are going to happen

[00:51:15] in my change, in my choices that I make in life

[00:51:21] but what I do know is that all of these hard moments

[00:51:24] and all of these beautiful moments

[00:51:26] will help me for the rest of my life

[00:51:30] and whatever challenge comes next

[00:51:34] I will handle it beautifully

[00:51:35] even though it's going to be so painful

[00:51:38] as life is so uncertain and things can happen so quickly

[00:51:43] that because of this journey I've prepared myself

[00:51:47] to hopefully deal with life's challenges

[00:51:49] in a beautiful encouraging mentoring,

[00:51:53] vulnerable way for the rest of my life

[00:51:55] no matter what happens next.

[00:51:57] Amazing.

[00:51:59] What about you Sam?

[00:52:00] What's next?

[00:52:03] Question, good question.

[00:52:05] Still reeling from this ordeal over here.

[00:52:07] So yeah, I mean, I still have a passion to play and compete.

[00:52:16] You need to try again?

[00:52:18] I don't know, undecided.

[00:52:21] I think what I'll do is I'll compete

[00:52:25] whether that be full-time or partially

[00:52:27] or less than partially over the next year

[00:52:31] and see if I still am feeling it.

[00:52:35] There's a lot of work that goes into a quad

[00:52:37] so I've learned that it's not a good thing

[00:52:42] to decide what you're gonna do for the next four years

[00:52:44] immediately after you experience

[00:52:46] one of the biggest moments of your life.

[00:52:48] You need to let that settle a bit.

[00:52:50] You need to sort of feel that out

[00:52:51] because it was very easy for me the last few times

[00:52:54] where I would just, yeah, I'm playing another four years,

[00:52:57] no question, let's go, make a partner, let's go

[00:53:00] and maybe rush some of those decisions

[00:53:02] versus sitting on it and thinking about it.

[00:53:04] Yeah, think about what I want.

[00:53:06] Think about what I've learned about this

[00:53:08] and playing with Dan, playing with any new partner

[00:53:12] you build a whole new group of skillset

[00:53:16] like these soft skills, right?

[00:53:18] Dealing with Dan was very different than dealing

[00:53:20] with Pedlo which was very different than dealing

[00:53:22] with Binstock which was very different

[00:53:24] than dealing with my very first partner.

[00:53:27] So yeah, like those each time you learn something

[00:53:32] that's very different than dealing with Pedlo

[00:53:32] and you're doing pivotal that you'll certainly apply

[00:53:34] to your next partnership and you'll continue to grow

[00:53:38] and you'll continue to use what you've learned

[00:53:42] to hopefully make the right decisions

[00:53:44] and do the best with what you have at the time.

[00:53:49] And I think that's all we can ask from ourselves.

[00:53:53] Final question for each of you here.

[00:53:56] Can you look at that screen there?

[00:53:58] If you can go back and say one thing to that version of you,

[00:54:04] one piece of advice, something you may have needed

[00:54:06] to hear in that moment that you know now,

[00:54:10] mind you I know it hasn't been that long since

[00:54:13] but with enough reflecting,

[00:54:14] I'm curious what you would say to yourselves.

[00:54:18] Get the ace.

[00:54:22] Serve the ball better so we can go for one more point.

[00:54:25] No, I mean, this is the thing, right?

[00:54:30] Is you can go back and you can look on that.

[00:54:35] I don't know if there's anything that you can say

[00:54:37] to that person, that version of myself

[00:54:39] that would make a really huge impact.

[00:54:43] Forced Dan to do more core in the morning.

[00:54:45] I don't know, right?

[00:54:46] Like there's nothing you can really do.

[00:54:48] What happened happened and was destined to happen.

[00:54:51] We sort of had this thing where

[00:54:53] I was getting really stressed out in Mexico

[00:54:56] for our qualification and I was saying,

[00:54:59] Dan more to calm myself down.

[00:55:01] I was saying, Dan this is done.

[00:55:03] We've done the work.

[00:55:04] This is like studying for an exam.

[00:55:06] You've done all the work.

[00:55:07] You've studied, everything's completed.

[00:55:11] Now you just have to go and write it, right?

[00:55:13] Like you just put your information on paper

[00:55:15] and this how I used to calm myself down

[00:55:16] at university before exams.

[00:55:18] I was a terrible exam writer.

[00:55:19] I was like, and it's sort of that idea morphed into

[00:55:25] this is all pre-decided.

[00:55:26] It's done, right?

[00:55:28] Like there's nothing more that you can do

[00:55:29] to impact the results.

[00:55:31] So let's just play it out.

[00:55:33] Let's just go and play it out and have fun.

[00:55:36] And try and have fun and try and enjoy the experience

[00:55:38] because me stressing about it

[00:55:40] isn't gonna make me play better.

[00:55:41] And me worrying about whether we qualify or not.

[00:55:45] It's like at the end of the day,

[00:55:46] like whether we qualify or we won't.

[00:55:47] Someone's gonna win, someone's gonna lose

[00:55:49] and it's a little bit of disassociation from it.

[00:55:51] And it's sort of like maybe a protection mechanism.

[00:55:55] But it allows your performance to come out.

[00:55:58] And for me to say to myself here,

[00:56:01] hold the hands hand tighter.

[00:56:04] I did what I thought was right and that's right.

[00:56:08] If I really look back on it,

[00:56:11] there are times in my life where I'm like,

[00:56:14] I don't know, maybe I would change what I did.

[00:56:16] But I think everyone's trying to operate off

[00:56:19] do the right thing at that time

[00:56:21] with the information that you have.

[00:56:23] And I think I did and I think Dan did too.

[00:56:25] So if there may be some comforting word, it's okay.

[00:56:30] This too shall pass.

[00:56:33] Dan's gonna, his back's gonna get better

[00:56:36] and we're not gonna hopefully have any permanent damage here.

[00:56:40] And it's shit.

[00:56:42] It's a shit situation.

[00:56:44] What do you say to someone whose parents just died?

[00:56:46] It's a shit situation.

[00:56:49] Fuck condolences.

[00:56:52] I'm here for you.

[00:56:54] It's an impossible situation.

[00:56:58] But I'm proud of how we tried

[00:57:00] and that's all we can say in the end to me.

[00:57:04] That's all I can say.

[00:57:07] It's funny because thank you for sharing that.

[00:57:10] My word would be, it would be thanks.

[00:57:14] One word, thanks.

[00:57:16] That was me a few weeks ago.

[00:57:20] And seeing that clip, it looks like

[00:57:23] knowing myself I gave it my all.

[00:57:25] So thank you Dan for doing that.

[00:57:28] Seeing Sam and how he's grasping

[00:57:31] and intertwining his hands with mine

[00:57:33] and walking me through that moment.

[00:57:36] Thanks.

[00:57:37] Thank you, Sam.

[00:57:41] And that sure is a conclusion of a choice

[00:57:46] and the conclusion of a situation

[00:57:47] and the conclusion of our moment as a team.

[00:57:52] But thanks for the journey.

[00:57:57] Like, thanks for getting to that point

[00:58:00] and thanks for all the support from everybody.

[00:58:03] And I really hope that again,

[00:58:10] we're such men that we reflect on our actions

[00:58:12] and how we can get better all the time

[00:58:15] every day at practice.

[00:58:17] This is what happened yesterday.

[00:58:19] I need to make sure that it doesn't happen

[00:58:21] or I'm better at it one percent the next day.

[00:58:24] And hopefully because of that moment

[00:58:27] and the impact of that moment,

[00:58:32] I and Sam and we just get better from it.

[00:58:36] Whether it's becoming a world-class athlete

[00:58:39] and you go for another quad,

[00:58:40] hopefully that moment makes you better.

[00:58:42] And hopefully that moment for me will make me better.

[00:58:46] So thanks.

[00:58:49] Gentlemen, thank you so much.

[00:58:51] Thank you for your time.

[00:58:52] Thank you for sharing.

[00:58:55] This was a powerful journey

[00:58:59] that didn't just start five years ago.

[00:59:01] It started much, much earlier than that for both of you

[00:59:04] and your paths happen to connect

[00:59:07] on this particular part of this journey

[00:59:09] and what comes next is to be seen

[00:59:13] and to be determined.

[00:59:15] But I have faith that you guys are gonna be up

[00:59:18] to great things in whatever way that comes.

[00:59:21] I'm confident that it will happen

[00:59:23] because honestly just witnessing that

[00:59:25] but hearing how you have reflected on it, talked about it.

[00:59:30] I've thought about how I would react in that moment

[00:59:32] and I would not have,

[00:59:34] I don't know if I could have handled it as well

[00:59:36] as you guys seem to have.

[00:59:38] And so I'm learning from you guys as you're talking

[00:59:41] and I thank you for sharing that with me

[00:59:44] and helping me understand how you thought

[00:59:47] about a moment like that

[00:59:49] and how you dissected it and said,

[00:59:53] this is how we're gonna move forward.

[00:59:55] And I know it's still a process but thank you.

[01:00:00] That's all I could really say.

[01:00:01] Thank you for your time.

[01:00:02] You guys are amazing.

[01:00:03] You're Olympians.

[01:00:04] You should be proud of all of that

[01:00:07] no matter what happened that day.

[01:00:11] And I'm rooting for you both every step of the way.

[01:00:15] Thank you so much gentlemen.

[01:00:16] Thank you, sir.

[01:00:17] Thank you.

[01:00:18] Thank you everybody.